Eternal Salvation – some scripture

I have been directed a number of times to Romans 11:17-24 (KJV) as proof that there is no eternal salvation.  However, as I was reading the passage, verses 22 and 23 jumped out at me.

22 Therefore consider the goodness and severity of God: on those who fell, severity; but toward you, goodness, if you continue in His goodness. Otherwise you also will be cut off. 23 And they also, if they do not continue in unbelief, will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again.

So we fell (or could fall) but we can come back and be re-grafted into the olive tree.

And another, to refute eternal salvation: 1 John 5:11-15 (NKJ), especially verse 15.

11 And this is the testimony: that God has given us eternal life, and this life is in His Son. 12 He who has the Son has life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have life. 13 These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life, and that you may continue to believe in the name of the Son of God. 14 Now this is the confidence that we have in Him, that if we ask anything according to His will, He hears us. 15 And if we know that He hears us, whatever we ask, we know that we have the petitions that we have asked of Him.

I think this can be taken either way since both “sides” use it.  For me, I am assured of my salvation and not fearful of losing it.

 

Psalm 103:17-20 (NKJ) is another one that is supposed to say we can lose our salvation.  I really think the difference of opinion comes in the definition, like I said in another post.  Does God REMOVE it or do we WALK AWAY from it?  Or as a third, do we DENY it altogether?  For me, Psalm 103:17-20 (NKJ) says that we can walk away from it, that we can come back.  This passage tells me that I need to hear God’s words and obey them.

 

I am assured of my salvation because I believe that God sent His Son, Jesus Christ to die for my sin – all my sin.  I show my love for God by obeying His commands and growing in a relationship with Him!

 

Striving to learn and live God's purposes,

Eternal Salvation – a definition is important, but . . . .

What do I really mean by eternal salvation?  I think that the differing definitions has caused some confusion.  Some may say it’s semantics, but it’s important at the same time to “be on the same page”.

So, eternal salvation.  Does God REMOVE His gift?  I do not believe so.  Can we WALK AWAY? Yes.

To be assured of heaven after accepting God’s gift of salvation.

An exact definition is hard to nail down!

God’s gift of salvation is free, but there are requirements of obedience and continued repentance.  There is a relationship to be built and there are consequences for disobedience.

We need to take grace into account, but I agree with one friend who stated that the “modern church” is preaching grace too much.  There is a very harsh side to God; He’s not all loving and sweetness.  I do not believe we are getting the whole picture of God that we could be from scripture.

So by eternal salvation, I think that I mean once you have accepted God’s gift, He will not remove that gift.

UNLESS. . . .

I am uncertain about whether or not we can totally give it back to Him, but I think we can.  We can totally deny Him and what He has done for us and that I think is where the question is coming to a head.  In my searching, this is the only place I see where we can “seal our own fate” so to speak.
There was a conversation about “screw ups” versus blatant, wilful sin.  In my opinion, both can and need to be repented of and neither would send us to hell after our acceptance of Jesus as our personal Saviour.

I’ll leave this topic here for now.  I’ll return with some scriptures at another time.  Some of the verses will be ones I am still struggling with while others will be ones I claim.

Striving to learn and live God's purposes,

I believe . . .

Watch for a post coming soon where I work through the process and define what I believe about eternal salvation.

It's been a tough couple of days.  I feel like I've neglected a lot of things - house, blog, etc - but I made it.  I'm comfortable with it now.  I'm tired, but it's a good tired.

Striving to learn and live God's purposes,

Eternal Salvation - This is eating me up.

I do not know what I believe.  Pray for me as I continue to dig into this topic.

Right now I feel like the Bible is full of contradictions.  What is one to believe?

And how much does eternal salvation really matter?  I know that I want to keep my relationship with God and that I am sure of.  That relationship will ensure my salvation.  For me, it's a mute point.

But I also believe that we need to know what we believe and why so that that we can defend ourselves.  I don't want to be a person that says, "this is what I believe and it doesn't matter why".

However, everything seems to be in question right now.  And it's tearing me up.  I'm in tears.  I'm at my wit's end.  It's all I can focus on, and other things are being left undone because of my focus on this.

Questioning hurts.  Growth hurts.  In the past, I've turned and run.  I can't do that with this.  Something is not letting me run.

I need to find the balance though.



Striving to learn and live God's purposes,

Eternal Salvation - Thinking On Scripture

Can we be sure of our salvation?  Did Jesus pay our debt ONCE and FOR ALL?  Or every time we sin, do we loose that gift?  Do we have to accept that gift over and over again, when we return to God in repentance of our latest sin?

This is an ongoing discussion in our home (with a friend) right now.  Here's some of the many verses we've been looking at:

1 John 5:11-15

Ephesians 2:8

1 John 2:1-6

A lot of these verses have "if we do" that implies that even as Christians we can do otherwise.  If we can choose to not follow God's Words, even as Christians, then are we truly saved.  If we are to overcome temptation (because God prepares a way out for us, 1 Cor. 10:13) and we don't, are we really saved?  What about the "mistakes", the "screw-ups"?

If sin separates us from God, then our salvation would be lost.  So, when I sin, I am separated from God?  Even as a Christian?

I don't know.  When my son disobeys me, I don't remove that relationship.  The relationship is strained, yes!  But there is repentance and a return to obedience.  He doesn't have to become my son all over again.  Why would God require that?  That sounds like a wishy-washy God to me - give the gift, take the gift, give the gift, take the gift.  Not a God I would want to follow.

So the verses that talk about those who sin being apart from God have to be seen in a light that match up with the verses that talk about the eternal life.

How can someone read the book of Romans and not be sure of their salvation?

Once I accept God's gift of salvation through Jesus Christ, God no longer sees my sin.  Am I right?  Am I a sinner?  I don't know, but I do know that I do continue to sin as a Child of God.  However, the Holy Spirit in my life does not allow me to continue in that sin and I come to my Father God and ask for His forgiveness.

I do not believe, and I have not been shown Scripture that proves it, that I am going to hell if there is un-repented sin in my life.  For example, if I die after being angry at my family, having not repented of that anger, I am still going to heaven.  My un-repented anger will not cause God to send me to hell, because Jesus died for ALL my sin, past, present and future (Eph. 2:8).  My repentance is not a reinstating of my salvation but rather a reconciliation of an injured relationship.

Here's another way to look at it:  Christians are the Bride of Christ.  When I hurt (sin against) my husband, that does not end our relationship; we are still married; I am still his bride.  Our relationship is damaged, but not ended.  I do not have to remarry him every time I hurt him (and our relationship).  I believe it is the same in our relationship with God.  He doesn't take that "brideship" away from us.  Yes, our sin hurts him and damages the relationship, but it is not ended altogether.

I'm sure there will be more on this to come.


Striving to learn and live God's purposes,